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Post by spuds on Feb 11, 2012 4:05:47 GMT -6
My latest solar panel story.Even if you dont hook em up now you can still claim the credit if you just stick em in the barn for now.Dont even have to itemize taxes,you can file simple 1040 and still take the credit.I took credit on my previous pile of panels. Prices like these are dirt dirt dirt cheap,crazy cheap,if you have ANY thoughts of using solar,lighting a chicken coop or outbuilding,an electric gate,a solar charger for the tractors,etc etc etc,do it NOW.Dont let this crazy cheap opportunity pass you by . Wound up with 794 watts of panels for 1420 dollars.Gave me a 50 watter free because glass cracked,and half price in a 75 watter with a damaged frame, Paid 2 dollars a watt for the rest. Worth the drive of 90 miles each way for sure,average price right now is about 4.50/watt plus shipping on new panels.Saved about 2000 dollars,wow! ,.............  Feb 1,2012 Going to get some panels tomorrow for get this....ONE DOLLAR a watt!!!!! 120 watt (13 ea) and 75 watt (4 ea) solar panels. Asking $1.00 per watt. Email or Call Ron   ==================== and one of these 170's for my Bud's golf cart project $130 for 150's.... $150 for 170's both slightly used. Quantity prices available. $290 ea. for the last 20 230watters! NEW Great Products, great price. Installing yourself returns 15-20% on investment. Also you get a 30% tax credit. Amazing time to install a Photo Voltaic electric system. Best if you have a south facing roof!  ========================= Feb 3,2012 Got 1500 watts for 1350, after the 30% tax credit comes to 63 CENTS/watt  ,now thats AMAZING,nice older,VERY DIRTY panels need cleaning(Cleaned with steel wool and vinegar to remove calcium buildup on glass fronts,they look like they just came off the factory floor now,amazing!!!!!),he threw in the aluminum racking too,we did good!  ======================= My site is poor here for solar,if SHTF I would deploy em here anyhow (I do have three small systems set up now,do lights next door and a pretty nice setup on Dodge Truck)... pharmerphil.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=eco&action=display&thread=11606....would do lights,some tv,comp,mixers,etc.....,these are more for 'the move' if it ever happens,got about 3800 watts now,thats enough to run all we run here now easily.So set to off grid in style far as electricity goes. Hard to believe I now have what would have been 16,000 dollars in panels just a few years back for about 3,500 (with the tax credits) over a couple years,just cant believe it. Cant believe those prices.When I started buying I paid 4 dollars/watt,Bud paid 4.50 in 2007 and we thought he did good.Bad economy has been very good for solar buyers. Cant pass it up,every time in past when i know I cheaped out and didnt jump I lost out, I was right,learned lesson,when the bargain presents you have to buy then . Say it again peoples,its time to buy solar if you ever wanted some. [image] |
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Post by Pharmer Phil on Feb 11, 2012 7:18:55 GMT -6
ok bro...how many would it take to power the 8- 2 bulb..4 ft. flourescent fixtures?? I suppose there's not time to gather them, hook them up and have them ready to go in..oh, about two weeks..huh.. Would be nice NOT to add to our electric bill once we start the bedding plants... already have the 3 trays of onions (yep they are up) and the geranium cuttings...under lights...soon, there will be many lil baby garden plants...over a thousand  |
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Post by spuds on Feb 11, 2012 14:43:57 GMT -6
how many watts in bulbs and how many hours?
say 100 watts x 10 hours would be 1000/watt hours.
1000 watts of panels put out 1000 watt hours in one hour.So 500 watts panels would take 2 hours sun to get the 1000 watt hours.
Then you have about 25-35% loss in batteries to inverter losses,running 12 volt lamps cuts a lot of loss out.
Winter about 1.5-2 good solar hours a day,summer about 4.
So a bit costly,but then again when power is out you have a lit up living room and can surf the net or watch TV,and light in kitchen to make dinner,then it really shines.
LOL,my neighbor I overheard talking to other neighbor,Spuds is on a different power line than us,their power was still on.....LOL!
My truck setup would be a good setup for you I think,and with 1 dollar a watt solar panels from craigslist,cost is very good.Now if you do do this you want 12 volt panels for a starter system,so about 130 watts max per panel before they go to 24 volt which is more involved and more expensive system parts.My panels run from 50 watts to 120 watts.
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Post by Pharmer Phil on Feb 12, 2012 8:31:48 GMT -6
well there is 8 - 4ft. flourescent fixtures.. each has 2 - 40 watt bulbs.. so that's 8x40x2 so that's 640 watts... and we run em' for ... 11 hours a day...from about the end of February till we can get the plants in the greenhouse...about 45 days 640 watts X 11 hours per day X usually about 45 days.. so that's 640x11x45..huh?? not much at cipherin' bro...whats that make it?? might be cheaper to bury me a cable to da neighbors wind generator  |
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Post by spuds on Feb 13, 2012 4:00:13 GMT -6
K,thats 7000 watt/hours a day.2 hours sun this time of year need 3500 watts panels,add 25% thats almost 4500 watts of panels!
You would have to look at LED bulbs and cut that power use waaaaaay back.
Now look at LED grow lights and power use and we will try again,first thing this system needs is serious power need for lights,its certainly doable.Current bulbs,nope,thats the first thing we would look at.Lets cut power needs a good 75% or so,then it will start making much better sense.
Guess next step is,how many square feet are we lighting,then we can look up LED grow lights and find equivalent sq ft coverage.
A quick rule of thumb is every dollar spent in reducing power use saves 4 dollars in solar system costs.
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Post by spuds on Feb 13, 2012 4:33:34 GMT -6
Look at this example....my biggest,hands down use is a very power hungry 52 inch plasma TV.It uses 450 watts of power.My 4000 watts panels would MAYBE put up 3000 watt hours with one hour sun good sun in winter and run TV about 6 hours a day no sweat in winter months. IF we did this off grid that TV would be replaced with a LED TV that uses about 100 watts or even 75 watts an hour.,12 hours/day would be about 1000 watt hours a day. An average sized,not super fancy refrigerator uses about 1000 watt hours a day. In summer figure 3-4 good sun hours a day.4000 watts panels to batteries to inverter for 120 volts would give you 9-12,000 watt hours a day to play with....now if you ran power to grid in a grid tied system,no batteries or inverter just about every watt you make goes into grid. Make 4000 watts in an hour,and say you are using 5000 watts in that hour you only pay retail power rate for 1000 watts,but here it gets sticky.....you make 4000 watts and use 3000 watts you get to sell them 1000 watts but they rob you.....you may pay 12 cents for a 1000 watts but they only buy it from you at maybe 3-4 cents a watt in most places.....few places actually have to buy from you at same rate they sell to you. Grid tie systems need professional installation and its costly.Up to consumer if payback is worth cost.Since power costs can only go up over the years your system gains in value. Me,its offgrid is the goal,no power company,never another power bill,(yeah,batteries do get replaced,inverters can die) but I like the freedom and not paying taxes,etc that comes with owning my own system. Guerilla power,hooking up to grid without anyones permission......lots of folks do this.You can buy small grid ties,about 300-1000 watt units for a few hundred bucks.Run a 1000 watts of panels into this grid tie box and just plug it into a plug on your house and BINGO! You have that power available into your uses before you use power company power. They are pretty safe too,not like hooking your genny to a house this way,then power goes out and you are backfeeding grid,dangerous for linemen.Grid tie units read the grids power then matches the cycle and feed power,no power from grid to match they stop feeding power,safe for linemen. This is what Im seriously looking at right now for using some of my panels to reduce load Im buying from power company.There are concerns with these,I would NOT mount them in the house or gagarage but outside in a fireproof area.Years ago these were also available and US approved but too expensive and went out of business,now they do make one,an Enphase,one inverter per panel,plug it in,US approved but again expensive little units. Enphase www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETBAla8Y05YCheapies www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vo0_aDfgRpMwww.youtube.com/watch?v=qtxBxS0Ghik&feature=fvwp&NR=1 |
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Post by Pharmer Phil on Feb 14, 2012 4:52:08 GMT -6
K,thats 7000 watt/hours a day.2 hours sun this time of year need 3500 watts panels,add 25% thats almost 4500 watts of panels! You would have to look at LED bulbs and cut that power use waaaaaay back. Now look at LED grow lights and power use and we will try again,first thing this system needs is serious power need for lights,its certainly doable.Current bulbs,nope,thats the first thing we would look at.Lets cut power needs a good 75% or so,then it will start making much better sense. Guess next step is,how many square feet are we lighting,then we can look up LED grow lights and find equivalent sq ft coverage. A quick rule of thumb is every dollar spent in reducing power use saves 4 dollars in solar system costs. The table we start bedding plants on is a little over 4' x 6'...so figure about a minimum 24 sq. ft...we fit 8 standard (11" x 21 1/4") plant flats under existing lights Bro...plus the onions... I have seen some pictures of LED set ups...and was way concerned about the light output...seems to be blue?? whats the word on that?? I had a reading light that was LED...I think the dang thing made my eyes worse   anyway..it sounds.looks like it would be expensive... for only the 45 days a year we use it.. I guess it's like buying a motor home...if you are only going to use it one week a year...why go the cost.. Now over time, gathering...searching and compiling parts...but not enuff time this coming season... How about the dirt cheapi-est way to heat the greenhouse... (Around the clock)...??small 400 watt electric heater...costs like *$%# to run Lil Buddy...  Thing dang near killed the mators last year...old post...will look for it.. But, 24 hours with it on...plants starting yellowing and wilting...removed it/fresh air...they came back...s-l-o-w-l-y |
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Post by spuds on Feb 14, 2012 6:25:02 GMT -6
Read a bit on em.....one utilizes only the light spectrum the plant actually needs,saw one where the tomato plant came out blue,then changed color when put outside,or could be left inside and fruits still normal colored.Used em in a space plant demo by NASA.
So lots of LED options and they are going commercial too in standard greenhouse setups,wouldnt know they were LED lights,no changes in veggies.
Saw a really cool Montana greenhouse,commercial,with solar hot water panels and in floor radiant solar heated fluid,with snow everywhere,very nice,lets see If I can find the picture
Would I do solar JUST for a short term lighting project,no....would I light the lawn,garage,run the laptop,or the freezer and refer....yup,then it makes more sense.
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Post by spuds on Feb 14, 2012 6:40:56 GMT -6
I like new tech in a lot of things,for greenhouses I like it.This will change greenhouses worldwide IMO,there is a lot of em now....And its being done because it is cheaper if you do it a lot ============================ Uploaded by HollandTradeNews on Oct 25, 2010 Since recently, the Netherlands have the world's highest penetration of LED lights. LED lights use up to 90% less energy than normal bulbs, which makes them highly attractive for energy intensive and cost competitive industries such as the greenhouse growers. Interestingly, the light that is needed for growing green plants is ideally red and blue. LED technology allows you to only produce those colours, again saving energy because you don't have to produce green or white light. We visited a grower of cresses (micro vegetables), who has recently installed a multilayered LED systems, which saves him money and space. ===================== Geeze I love youtube! www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3RiyaaJI2kDouble Click to enlarge screenshots   |
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Post by spuds on Feb 14, 2012 7:00:24 GMT -6
OK,using solar heated water to heat a greenhouse,this will work commercially in Montana in winter,there they ran a row of solar water panels along the front of the greenhouse about 10 feet out and a couple feet off the ground to keep above snow. The concept is here,love THAT farm,and the solar cushman,and the solar electric,etc etc etc.Would die for such a setup,eh? Solar greenhouse with solar hot water panels for radiant (floor,soil?) heating...  Solar Cushman  blogs.dickinson.edu/farm/learn/solar/ |
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Post by spuds on Feb 14, 2012 7:34:08 GMT -6
BTW,speaking of solar hot water which is the most efficient,quickest payback use of solar....these are the solar showers at San Simeon Calif campground on the beach,our favorite campsite. These showers are up and running by 10 am or so and remain hot a couple hours after sundown.You wouldnt know them from any other shower,plenty hot water.If they insulated the tanks they could have hot water 24/7 pretty much just from the solar.A home generally has nat gas or electric system that gets its heat from the panels during the day so the fossil fuel heater doesnt have to run.  |
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