Crops for a flood plain

[hunter63]

At "The Place" my lower field, about 7 acres is in a flood plain.

So far the farmer down the road has had corn, beans and last year hay in this field.

When it doesn't flood (and when it does there is no question that it is a flood plain), he has gotten a very good yeild from it.
When it does , pretty much nothing.

Any ideas on a cash crop that is flood tolerant?

[lilsparrow]

Rice? Don't know, just asking...

[Talks With Beagles]

A lot of guys would use land like that for hay and pasture, but since it has produced good yields of corn, I suspect it has more potential than that. The question is: How much risk do you want to take with your crop? Just like with other investments; the greater the risk, the greater the gain, or loss. Are you feeling lucky this year?

In order to plant an aquatic crop, like wild rice or cranberries, you will need to have absolute control over the water level. You will need to be able to drain and flood it at specific times. This will require a system of dikes or levees, and maybe some pumps. Ask the people of New Orleans about that!

Corn will tolerate a certain amount of seasonal flooding, unless it happens during the wrong season, like planting or harvest time. If the water comes up and goes down in a few days, you might be able to get away with it; but if the water lays on the land for weeks at a time, forget it. If the land is submerged for more than two weeks a year during the growing season, it is classified as a "wetland". There are some legalities involved here, but I believe the laws have been changed since the last time I looked into it, so you'd have to check.

Do you really need to make money off this land? There are government programs which will pay you to not grow stuff on land like this. They may be more trouble than they're worth, but it's worth looking into. With or withput government assistance, you might consider dedicating this land to wildlife habitat. Evereybody likes wildlife, don't they?

[hillsidedigger]

If it doesn't phlood to frequently or if the site drains well and quickly after flooding (no standing water for weeks in the spring), I might suggest interplanting european black alder with black walnut trees, with walnuts at 24' by 24' with alders at 8' X 8'. The alder, a nitrogen fixer, grows rapidly and can yield pharwood or pulp within 10 or 15 years and trains the walnut trees to grow straight up. As well, the alder sprouts and grows rapidly after cutting so can yield a harvest every 10 to 15 years. The first few seasons, garden crops can be raised between the rows of trees which will aid considerably in weed and vine control while the young trees are becoming established.

After 40 or 50 years, the walnut wood could be incredibly valuable and the flood plain is stabilized and buffered in the interim. Walnuts will begin to drop after a few seasons, for people and wild animals and the alder is a preferred browse for deer.

I feel flood plains should never be extensively plowed.

[jeanette]

i gotta agree with the above... if you gotta plant something, plant corn, then take out crop insurance if the land can be insured, if not don't plant anything..

[hunter63]

Thanks for the in-put.
I'll add a little history:
This field used to be farmed before i purchased the land, the land next door is the same, but has never (?) has never beeb planted. Lots of tall grass, weeds (over your head) etc.
So I would like to keep the weeds down #1.

The farmer that was planting it did grow corn/ beans, but did insurer it every year and didn't really count on it to be harvested. Good for me as it provided a food plot for wild-life in most years and in the years that he did harvest it he used the "tall" harvest, only taking the tops and left a lot behind. Unfortunately he is not in good enough health to continue. The new guy doesn't want to bother with insurance, so after loosing a couple of crops I had him put in hay.
Was a lot of weed seeds drought in by the last flood so we just "brush-hogged it".

The land isn't flooded enough to plant rice, good idea, but I guess I didn't give a good enough discription in my orginal post. (would be good for ducks though)

The stat had a program to give out black walnuts to plant, and I did give this serious thought but as the rest of the land is being taken over by natural trees/ plants etc. I would really like to keep this field.

No I don't "Need to make money on this field", I guess I was just corious if anyone had dealt with this issue.

We do plan to retire there and would give another income if I could find something that would be profitable.

Will be checking w/ the county agent to get his input.

Over the years it has been a good food plot, Brother-in -law killed his first two deer (in 19 years) in that field.

[Talks With Beagles]

I have given this some thought since yesterday. If you really want to make money here, just forget about farming and turn it into a marina and/or campground. Okay, I wouldn't do that if it was mine, but everybody is not like me.

Now if you want a project to keep yourself busy in your retirement years, and you don't care about making money, you could turn it into a market garden. You will never recover your investment in construction and equipment, but you might break even on a yearly basis after that. You will need to contour the land into a series of raised beds, like the ones Phil talks about, but on a larger scale. The space between the beds will be wet most of the time, and the beds, if they are high enough, will be above water most of the time. Don't make steep sided ditches, though. What you want is a gentle slope so that you can mow it with a tractor. The low part will grow some kind of grass, but will revert to trees or brush eventually if you don't mow it once a year.

If you want it for wildlife, I agree that it should be kept as a field or meadow, since there are plenty of trees and brush around it. You could plant corn and just not harvest it, or you could put in some kind of annual or perennial grass crop. Perennial would be low maintenance; just mow it once or twice a year. Annual gives you more flexibility because you can time a fall crop to be green for deer season, if that's what you want. It is probably too wet for rye or wheat, otherwise I would recommend that. If you want to bring in waterfowl, see if you can get oats or barley to grow there. They are more tolerant of wet conditions, probably about like corn.

Do you have river front access here? Another option would be to dredge it out and make a back-water slough off the river. For this you will need lots of money, unless you have your own equipment. You will also need to deal with a permitting process that can be rather frustrating and might easily take years to get through. On the other hand, the state might actually help you with it, but don't count on it.

[hunter63]

Yes, there is about 860 +ft of frontage on the Kickapoo River, on a curve, so the frood plain kinda juts out a little.

When it floods, not every year, the field floods , but the river bank is still high-ground, sounds funny but I guess New Orleans is the same way.

I think i will stay with the hay, possible strips of corn or oats, more for the wildlife than any income producing crop.
Did purchase a tractor last fall, in time to use the brush hog on the weeds. So will now be able to plow, disc or what ever I need to do.

Have been wheeling and dealing for 2 years on a tractor, looking for the best deal, when finally the wife say's, " just go buy one, I'm tired of hearing about it".
So, when she says go, I go. (good wife, can't stand my whining)

Don't want to get involved w/ campground or anything like that, don't need the hassle.
Thanks for the input.

[Talks With Beagles]

If your tractor has a rear mounted PTO, I would recommend a rotto-tiller as your next attachment. Then you will need only one tool to work up your land instead of a plow, disc, harrow, quack hog, etc. If you want to break down the clumps further, just go over the field again. There is such a thing as "over tilling", so don't get carried away. If the soil is a little wet, just go over it once, which will fluff it up and help it dry out. Then you can try again in a day or two.

The river bank is probably higher than the surrounding land because somebody dredged the channel once and just piled the dredgings along the shore. Next time the field floods, try to determine if the higher bank is keeping water in or out of the field. It is possible that the river overflows the bank, and then the bank keeps the water from running back down into the river when the level recedes. In this case, you could cut a few gaps in the bank to facilitate drainage. Try to observe it when the river is rising, and then again when it is receding.

If the water level in the channel and in the field is always the same, then you are probably dealing with the water table itself. Not much you can do about that except build the field up higher, which is a lot of trouble to go through and may not be legal.

I think you have a good plan with the wildlife food plot. Seven acres is too small a plot to make money on nowadays except with specialty crops that are risky and labor intensive. Legend has it that a man who had farmed professionally for 30 years once won ten million dollars in the lottery. When asked if he would now retire, he said; "No, I'll keep farming until the money's all gone."

[jeanette]

thats what jerry says!! who by the way has farmed this land for 30 years.. i'll ask him what he thinks...

[hunter63]

T.W.B., LOL I hear you.
Once stopped at a farmer's (or should be pharmer's) house to ask about turkey hunting on his land.
He said," go ahead, but you will have to let your self in and out of the gate, I going to Los Vegas !"

I thought that was kinda odd as everyone else was plowing and getting ready to plant.

Said he was just going to plant what was left of his money, to see if that would grow!

Yes, tractor is a 30 hp diesel, with a pto, bucket, brush hog, and back blade. I agree that a tiller was recomended for the reasons you mentioned. Also thinking about a post hole digger as well, want to build a pole barn to put the tractor in.

[Talks With Beagles]

Mine is only a 16 HP, but it's 4WD. I have the same attachments, plus a rotto-tiller and a pair of log skidding tongs that I rigged up to the drawbar. It's amazing how big a log that little tractor will pull if you get one end a few inches up off the ground.

Before you buy a post hole digger, I would recommend you do some checking around. If it's just for the one project, you might be better off to rent or borrow one; but if you plan to do a lot of fencing it will be worth buying one.

You might want to do some checking around before you put up a pole barn too. Take a look at some of them in the neighborhod that have been there awhile. With some soil types, and especially if you have a high water table, the poles have a tendancy to creep up out of the ground from freezing and thawing. There is a scientific principle involved, but I've forgotten what it is. People just say, "the frost heaves them up". My neighbor built several barns and sheds like that, which is why I know about it.

Have you seen those sheet metal carports that people are putting up all over? You can also get them enclosed with doors and everything. I had mine done by professionals, but I'm sure you could build something like that yourself if you wanted to. They don't need a foundation of any kind, but you could put one on a cement slab or wooden floor. I built up a pad of limestone gravel, but some people just put theirs right on the ground.

[Deleted]

The carport your referring to is the one pop bought for storage.
They are affordable,go up quick,and can be put up virtually any where.
The frame is aluminum an sets on the ground.
we dug holes to pour concrete to anchor it down an it works great!
A 16x20 stores a Massey ferguson40(with bucket and rear blade),3 garden/lawn tractors,1 rototiller(walk behind),a disc,plow(single),and a pull behind tiller that goes with one of the garden/lawn tractors.
All that and room to get around still.
Hunter, you've been given some great advice and I cant come up with anything better to add other than Keep us updated on what you decide.
I love projects!

[hunter63]

Yeah right, thanks guys. Just to let you know what I'm thinking.

Have seen a-LOT of those car-ports, seems like a good bang for the buck. Havwe a cousin that went the the route of a complete gararge, built it in back of the one he had, added a door on the back of his old one and sorta enclosed the whole thing. (works on old Mustangs).
Been talking with him a little.

As " The Place" is a log cabin, I wanted to stay away from "new looking" buildings, what I had in mind was a "car-port" built w/ old light poles,(one of my drinking buddies is the head of the co-op, so poles come along at times), trusses w/ large over-hang, open sides for now.

The idea was to pour a wide footing around the perimeter, roof it over, then use the out side to stack fire wood, in effect creating walls.

At some future time, permanent walls could be added. Actually sorta have a horse-shoe shapped wood pile at this time, which gave me the idea.

Note: have a-LOT of dead elms on the land, all died in the last couple of years (?), so have a lot of fire wood, if I can get it down and cut up before it gets rotten.

The land has about four levels, from the side of the hill, (cabin), going down to a level field, ( this was leveled and drain tiles added at the lower corner for a tobacco field, I' told), then down to a little wooded point, then down to the lower field and river.
Total drop about 250 ft?,
So building on the upper field hasn't been a problem, have had a shed there for 12 years.
This pic is the shed at the top of the upper field, you can see the cabin on the hill behind it.


Tractor is in the "lean-too" on the "tazma-shed" at this time.
The trailers are the "Old place", used for 10 years before the cabin.

[Deleted]

I understand what yer sayin now!
Tryin to keep the "Log cabin" theme.
TWB was right on the post hole digger,if you can rent one for a day it might be a good idea.
As far as frost heave, if you dig below the "frost line" you should be OK.
A local builder or contractor would probably tell ya what that depth is!
Here in IL, at least around here, it runs 36-38 inches deep.
If ya get a digger for the holes most are 4-6 feet long so you'd be plenty deep.
I like the idea of "walls"! Good air circulation yet a good blocker when in the shed!
Looks like ya got a big job ahead!

[hunter63]

It's always something.....................

[jeanette]

LOL is that " dads pad when moms mad"?

[hunter63]

Yeah, still could be. If she isn't happy, nobody is happy.

She likes the cabin a lot more, so spends a-lot more time there now the when we just had the trailers.

Intrestingly enough, yesterday, Jan.13 was the day we purchased the land in 1989. It is also our anniversary.

Lots of joke over the year about "buying your wife dirt" as a gift! The years before I was picking up potting soil, showed up at the check-out with with the two bags of potting soil and a card.
The check out girl asked me if I was buying my wife "dirt for our anniversary", I said yes, my card in my wallet said "23 years, dirt" and an arguement insued between the check-out girl and a couple of other ladies in line. What a hoot.
Sooo...., when we did purchase the land, all I heard
was "dirt again?".

The trailer (Shasta) was added the following year, after the first driveway (term used loosely) and was used for all these years as a hunting/fishing/ camping/canoing/ four wheeling/spot.
Was pretty primitive, but we had a lot of fun over the years.
Did have elect,(wire running down the hill) so we could hook up a lot of campers, for ours, our friends and kids.

The "Blue room" (a-frame camper )was given to me as it had a bad roof, so I hauled it there, set it up (was a sorta of pop-up) permanently and roofed it over.
Was to be a shed (portable, wired for elect, furnace and sink, and free). Turned into a guest room/shed.

The "taz-ma' shed was built by the local high school kids and hauled to the land. (quite a story about that also.). May be another time.
Lean-too's were added to include a "bath room" of sorts, and storage for the mowers etc.

Haven't fiqured out what to do with the trailers yet, maybe buy some more land further north, move them and start again.

Any way quite a ramble for a Sat. Morning.